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Posted by terryp on January 31, 2003 at 13:12:26:

In Reply to: Adam's Original pair posted by Shanty on January 31, 2003 at 10:49:12:

a female produced by Adam to breed back to the male. Kind of funny (maybe not so funny) that I questioned if the bairds he produced were Texas or Mexican because Adam didn't have any locality data. He responded they were Texas Bairdi. I recollect when Adam posted a pic of the male (it's more confusing since the head doesn't show the gray that you said it has) that he referred to it as one of the male yearling. From that, I was figuring it to be an offspring of the founders. I don't recall, since I've gotten bairdi, that he referred to it as his founder. With no locality data, the male founder can be a Tex or Mex, but he does look Mex. Several people had thought of the founder male being the offspring of Adam's founders and several of us were hoping to get offspring with the orange it had. The male founder you have may be the offspring of a Tex/Mex cross breeding. Breed him to the Tex female and you get the bairds myself and others have gotten. Not only do I have an idea of what they might look like now; I own a trio. lol. A nice looking snake, but NOT what I wanted. I wonder what happened to the others that were in the original Tex/Mex cross clutch? There's no traceable locality data according to Adam Block and Adam got his founders from two unknown souces. How convenient. The founders are Texas or Mexican dpending on which side of the Rio Grande River they came form. A bairdi could come from the Texas side and look Mexican, but it is still a Texas Bairdi. I feel the male founder you have Shannon may be an offspring from a Tex/Mex cross breeding. It may not be if I wish to exclude, what someone says it looks like (a Texas or a Mexican) or I recall Adam Block doing a cross breeding and I'll try to check the archives. In any case, I didn't have any intention of having a Tex/Mex cross. My intent with having Bairdi was to keep Texas (having no Mexican outbreedings) and Mexican (having no Texas outbreedings). It's funny I would post not having heard of someone doing a Tex/ Mex breeding and yet possibly ownig a trio from one. It's unfortunate and I don't know what to do with this trio. They're great looking Bairdi, but not what I want. D***n, this sets my project/projects back. Thanks for the info Shannon.

:Since Adam's original pair is now in my snake room I want to make some observations:

:1) They are from two different sources--both unknown.

:2) The male is more Mexican bairdi looking than he is Texas bairdi looking. He is pretty much red with a gray head (sounds like a Mexican bairdi description to me).

:3) The female is a typical Texas bairdi.

:4) This might be that Mexican bairdi X Texas bairdi cross of which you are alluding, Dwight.

:5) And, of course, they both might be Texas bairdi BUT the male simply LOOKS like a Mexican bairdi.

:I don't know the case here, but if they are MB X TB, there are a few of these in your hands right now Terry. If you are a locale buff, then egads. If you simply enjoy beautiful bairdi then wow! One is from one side of the Rio Grande; one is from bloodlines from the other side. A bit like being from one stretch of Hwy 277 vs being from another stretch of the same Hwy. Ok, so I am messing with locale a bit, but not by much.

:I also have Hwy 277 bairdi and Davis Mountains bairdi. They are different looking as neonates. Hwy 277 look quite similar to Mexican bairdi--lighter gray. Davis Mts bairdi have a more brown ground color. The three Mexican bairdi neonates I have are from three different sources--1.0 from Susan Hardy and 1.1 from the Hammacks. The Hammacks have two different lines of the Mexican bairdi. My 1.1 are similar but I see some subtle differences in the speckling on the sides of the female.

:Go to www.qualityreps.com to see photos of Adam's original pair. In that photo the male's head does NOT show the gray. It is gray.

:Hope this post doesn't boggle too many minds. But those are my random thoughts at this juncture.

:Shannon Hiatt
:

Follow Ups:

Back cross Shanty 01/31/03 (10)
- The question on my mind is . . .> terryp 01/31/03 (9)
  - The question on my mind is . . .> Shanty 01/31/03 (8)
    - The only question I asked . . .> terryp 02/01/03 (7)
      - Yes, yes, and yes Shanty 02/01/03 (6)
        
        I think I got the data right . . > terryp 02/01/03 (5)
        
        Writing to Learn Shanty 02/02/03 (4)
        
        You mean I get something out . . . terryp 02/02/03 (3)
        
        Re: You mean I get something out . . . terryp 02/02/03 (2)
        
        You dirty, insulting.... KJUN 02/05/03 (1)
        
        I thought these forums were monitored . . .> terryp 02/10/03 (0)