Re: The Need for Subspecies

[ Follow Ups ] [ Post Followup ] [ The Herp Law Forum ] [ FAQ ]

Posted by Dave Beamer on November 10, 1998 at 23:19:02:

In Reply to: Re: The Need for Subspecies posted by RP on November 10, 1998 at 22:31:29:

I believe all state lists should contain taxonomic units that reflect discovered evolutionary entities. Since subspecies can't be discovered I can see absolutely no reason to list them. When subspecies are requested to be listed it is under the apparent assumption that they are a taxonomic unit. They are clearly not a taxonomic unit and therefore are precluded from being listed. If state lists are not to be based on taxonomic units what are they to be comprised of? I am not sure how you could protect a species but not intend to protect the entire species. I can state that some populations are protected in a state while others are not. The plainbelly water snake has recently been added to the federal ESA list. Populations in the northeast section of IN are federally threatened while those in the SW corner are not. These would even be the same "subspecies". There is a trend towards managing populations and ecosystems today rather than wasting time with clinal variation like in the old days. This listing also had a lot to do with the subspecies debate. As there was really no discrete taxonomic unit to protect (plainbellies have a large range and only some populations were seriously threatened) it was decided to protect the declining populations only.
Dave Beamer

Follow Ups:

Re: The Need for Subspecies RP 11/11/98 (20)
- Re: The Need for Subspecies Dave Beamer 11/11/98 (19)
  - Re: The Need for Subspecies arguement for Dave 11/15/98 (10)
    - Re: The Need for Subspecies Man from Lake Titikaka 3/05/99 (0)
    - Re: The Need for Subspecies Dave Beamer 11/16/98 (8)
      - Re: The Need for Subspecies Opinion 11/16/98 (0)
      - Re: The Need for Subspecies ok, how about this 11/16/98 (6)
        
        Re: The Need to Step Back and Regroup Jwemes 11/16/98 (0)
        
        Re: The Need for Subspecies Dave Beamer 11/16/98 (4)
        
        Subspecies Dave Russ 01/19/00 (0)
        
        Re: The Need for Subspecies answer 11/16/98 (2)
        
        Re: The Need for Subspecies Dave Beamer 11/16/98 (1)
        
        Re: The Need for Subspecies Mike 11/16/98 (0)
  - Re: The Need for Grammar Dave Burge 11/12/98 (0)
  - cut and paste, dave El Gringo Viejo 11/11/98 (6)
    - Re: cut and paste, dave Flora Bennett. 4/23/99 (1)
      - Re: cut and paste, dave Jewell-39@webtv.net 10/31/99 (0)
    - Re: cut and paste, dave evelynday 4/12/99 (0)
    - Re: cut and paste, dave Starbuck 3/21/99 (2)
      - Re: cut and paste, dave Linda 4/28/99 (0)
      - Re: cut and paste, dave Pat 3/25/99 (0)

Post a Followup

Name:
E-Mail:

Subject:

Comments:
: I believe all state lists should contain taxonomic units that reflect discovered evolutionary entities. Since subspecies can't be discovered I can see absolutely no reason to list them. When subspecies are requested to be listed it is under the apparent assumption that they are a taxonomic unit. They are clearly not a taxonomic unit and therefore are precluded from being listed. If state lists are not to be based on taxonomic units what are they to be comprised of? I am not sure how you could protect a species but not intend to protect the entire species. I can state that some populations are protected in a state while others are not. The plainbelly water snake has recently been added to the federal ESA list. Populations in the northeast section of IN are federally threatened while those in the SW corner are not. These would even be the same "subspecies". There is a trend towards managing populations and ecosystems today rather than wasting time with clinal variation like in the old days. This listing also had a lot to do with the subspecies debate. As there was really no discrete taxonomic unit to protect (plainbellies have a large range and only some populations were seriously threatened) it was decided to protect the declining populations only. : Dave Beamer

Optional Link URL:
Link Title:
Optional Image URL:

[ Follow Ups ] [ Post Followup ] [ The Herp Law Forum ] [ FAQ ]

KINGSNAKE.COM

Enjoy all our content free of charge with a user account that gives you full access to every feature. For added visibility, paid options are available - post in our Classifieds, showcase your business with Banner Ads or a Directory listing, promote reptile events, and more.

Re: The Need for Subspecies

KINGSNAKE.COM

Quick Links

Community

Legal & Safety

Support