Re: juvenile/hatchlings for sale - opinions, here we go again.....

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Posted by m chambers on May 11, 2001 at 11:36:39:

In Reply to: Re: juvenile/hatchlings for sale - opinions posted by marisa on May 09, 2001 at 14:37:01:

okay..let's do "read between the lines" thing
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: Well I agree that baby iguanas shouldbe available to those of us who do care.

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I to agree, but how do you/they/I know that you/they/I are one of the caring ones ?
**************

: My website is going to be geared at this subject exactly. No pet store should sell iguanas. NO PET STORE.

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Even though we are in agreement, how would the general public including the ones that cares find a iguana ? Have it shipped in ? Go to a herp show ? How many breeders do you know in the business of breeding captive iguanas ? I've been in the "bizz" for over 35 years and I only know maybe 3 people that try to breed/captive raise iguanas. And most give up or become disgusted when they can't sell their iguanas. I mean most of the average person doesn't see the reason these captive borns/raise breeders should be getting more money for their time and trouble and the fact that the iguanas ae parasitic free and etc.
**************

: Like puppies, we all know most puppies in pet stores are from puppy mills. So most of us go adopt one, or go to a local breeder where we can pick our puppy out, and talk to the breeder about the needs of that dog, is size expectations, etc.

**************
Puppy mills , puppy smills. Yes there are and will be puppy mills. but with all the involvement of agencies and the press these pups are not showing up at petstores as much as before. Now let's go into the puppy mill question. Pick up a general metropolitan newspaper, say the Kansas City Sunday edition. Gee ! No less then 60-75-105 adds for pups mostley being backyard breeders. Or in other words the non-puppy mill people that bred their dogs for whatever reason. Let's do an estimation of how many pups might be for sale based on 60 adds in that newspaper (by now you should of figured that I WAS in the retail pet business).60 times an average of 5 pups per litter = 300 pups plus. Most of the "mills" that got busted some years ago only had 100 or less pups on hand. (I realize we could go back and forth on numbers but it is a moote point).
**************

I believe it should be the same for iguanas. For those people who want a baby iguana, they should be sold be private breeders, where people can have a chance to A. think over there choice, because finding a breeder and stuff takes time, it might help people think twice. B. talk to the breeder and learn facts.

**************
Again i ask how many iguana breeders do you know ?
**************

: Yes I know breeders aren't always good people, and don't do the best for animals. But like puppies again, the breeders who don't hold up standards won't get business for the main part. Clean kennels with strong bloodlines are where most puppies are sold. I feel the same situation would work with iguanas. Instead of seeing that cute iguana in the pet store, people will have to read about them and learn and contact breeders instead of having the abililty to make impulse buys. This will at least be a step in the right direction for iguanas.

**************
I have an idea. If we could only stop the imported iguanas then we would have no problem. Right ? Since the imported or "farmed raised" iguanas probably makes up of the 99.99% iguanas sold in this country.
**************

: A 10 year old doesn't need a hermit crab either(which I personally keep quite a few of and trust me they are not easy pets to keep healthy). All animals deserve a responsible owner with the means and ability to deal with its needs, and care. No animal life is worth more than anothers in my eyes. No matter if it is a dog, cat, rat or iguana.

: Marisa
**************
I know some 50 or so year olds that shouldn't be keeping even hermit crabs. Maybe we should be addressing the mentality of the consumer on purchasing reptiles as well. It's one thing for a pet store to be selling baby or problem iguanas. And yes iguanas are probamatic reptiles in the sense they should be fed on a daily basis, large cages, the expense of proper lighting, the expense on proper heating. etc. I always use the 50-50 scenario. Meaning some place here we need to blame the consumer as well. When you can buy a iguana for under $2.00 on the wholesale level and retail it for under $10.00 you are going to have the "throw away pet "syndrom.
So I tryed to enlight my customers on the proper needs of iguanas. I reframed from selling them entirely at the end of my retail days. But did Joe Blow down the street? NO ! Beleive me when I say it was like cutting off an arm to try to convince people (the customer) that they couldn't just put an iguana in a 10 gallon tank and only feed it lettuce.

P.S. I have other postings of similar interest on other forums.

M Chambers

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: : okay..let's do "read between the lines" thing : ************** : : Well I agree that baby iguanas shouldbe available to those of us who do care. : ************** : I to agree, but how do you/they/I know that you/they/I are one of the caring ones ? : ************** : : My website is going to be geared at this subject exactly. No pet store should sell iguanas. NO PET STORE. : ************** : Even though we are in agreement, how would the general public including the ones that cares find a iguana ? Have it shipped in ? Go to a herp show ? How many breeders do you know in the business of breeding captive iguanas ? I've been in the "bizz" for over 35 years and I only know maybe 3 people that try to breed/captive raise iguanas. And most give up or become disgusted when they can't sell their iguanas. I mean most of the average person doesn't see the reason these captive borns/raise breeders should be getting more money for their time and trouble and the fact that the iguanas ae parasitic free and etc. : ************** : : Like puppies, we all know most puppies in pet stores are from puppy mills. So most of us go adopt one, or go to a local breeder where we can pick our puppy out, and talk to the breeder about the needs of that dog, is size expectations, etc. : ************** : Puppy mills , puppy smills. Yes there are and will be puppy mills. but with all the involvement of agencies and the press these pups are not showing up at petstores as much as before. Now let's go into the puppy mill question. Pick up a general metropolitan newspaper, say the Kansas City Sunday edition. Gee ! No less then 60-75-105 adds for pups mostley being backyard breeders. Or in other words the non-puppy mill people that bred their dogs for whatever reason. Let's do an estimation of how many pups might be for sale based on 60 adds in that newspaper (by now you should of figured that I WAS in the retail pet business).60 times an average of 5 pups per litter = 300 pups plus. Most of the "mills" that got busted some years ago only had 100 or less pups on hand. (I realize we could go back and forth on numbers but it is a moote point). : ************** : I believe it should be the same for iguanas. For those people who want a baby iguana, they should be sold be private breeders, where people can have a chance to A. think over there choice, because finding a breeder and stuff takes time, it might help people think twice. B. talk to the breeder and learn facts. : ************** : Again i ask how many iguana breeders do you know ? : ************** : : Yes I know breeders aren't always good people, and don't do the best for animals. But like puppies again, the breeders who don't hold up standards won't get business for the main part. Clean kennels with strong bloodlines are where most puppies are sold. I feel the same situation would work with iguanas. Instead of seeing that cute iguana in the pet store, people will have to read about them and learn and contact breeders instead of having the abililty to make impulse buys. This will at least be a step in the right direction for iguanas. : ************** : I have an idea. If we could only stop the imported iguanas then we would have no problem. Right ? Since the imported or "farmed raised" iguanas probably makes up of the 99.99% iguanas sold in this country. : ************** : : A 10 year old doesn't need a hermit crab either(which I personally keep quite a few of and trust me they are not easy pets to keep healthy). All animals deserve a responsible owner with the means and ability to deal with its needs, and care. No animal life is worth more than anothers in my eyes. No matter if it is a dog, cat, rat or iguana. : : Marisa : ************** : I know some 50 or so year olds that shouldn't be keeping even hermit crabs. Maybe we should be addressing the mentality of the consumer on purchasing reptiles as well. It's one thing for a pet store to be selling baby or problem iguanas. And yes iguanas are probamatic reptiles in the sense they should be fed on a daily basis, large cages, the expense of proper lighting, the expense on proper heating. etc. I always use the 50-50 scenario. Meaning some place here we need to blame the consumer as well. When you can buy a iguana for under $2.00 on the wholesale level and retail it for under $10.00 you are going to have the "throw away pet "syndrom. : So I tryed to enlight my customers on the proper needs of iguanas. I reframed from selling them entirely at the end of my retail days. But did Joe Blow down the street? NO ! Beleive me when I say it was like cutting off an arm to try to convince people (the customer) that they couldn't just put an iguana in a 10 gallon tank and only feed it lettuce. : P.S. I have other postings of similar interest on other forums. : M Chambers

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