Re: to Lester...

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Posted by Lester G. Milroy III on June 07, 2002 at 18:59:33:

In Reply to: Re: to Lester... posted by Chad on June 07, 2002 at 12:14:47:

: : : I notice in the post below you say that Phrynosoma platyrhinos are protected in Cal. but i am confused hopefully you can set me straight on this but they are illegal to collect in california but yet places collect them Phrynosoma platyrhinos in NV and sell them over the internet? Is this a state or a Federal thing. and am i just completely wrong on this.

: : : Been doing so much reading on them My head is starting to spin.

: : : Another Question, What Species of Horned Lizard is or was from the Oklahoma and is it possible to get a permit to breed these lizards and would you know a source for them.

: : : Sorry for the stupid Questions.

: : : Chad

: : :Chad, the Desert HLs in California are protected from commercial collection. Permits are required for collection and are limited to the number that can be collected. It is a wildlife management guideline. It is called protecting natural resources and management. Nevada has their own guidelines for resource and wildlife management. Nevada will more than likely have species declines in the not to distant future, just like California has had in the past and continues to have today. At this point, Nevada is looking to make money for their general fund to support its growth. The animals are the the ones paying the price. In a 7 year period, the number of Desert Horned Lizards captured for the pet trade added up to 35,000. The number that survived? Unknown, but probably about 1 in 2500, after 2 to 5 five months in captivity. The number dead after field collection and before entering the pet trade, probably 1 in 15. Not good numbers. The HLs in Oklahoma are the Texas HL, Phrynosoma cornutum, and they are a protected species. You would have to check with Oklahoma Fish and Game to obtain permits. Lester G. Milroy III

: Ok thanks for the information, i just wasnt clear how the same species could be illegal in one state to collect and still legal in a bordering state. I would of thought that it would be as a Species for the entire country not per state.

: Dang talkin bout ruining my day tell me my Okie Horny Toads are the Texas Variety.... 8-( Dont you know us Okies dont like Texans very much..

: Chad

:Hello again Chad. There have been folks fron Nevada cross the California - Nevada border, collect HLs from California and return to Nevada and sell the HLs in the pet trade. When they do this, it is called poaching and then comes under Federal Law with a violation under the Lacy Act. One of the projects in the works is ID of species using DNA markers. Population variation will aid in identifying populations of animals, almost to the exact locality of their collection. I am also working on the issue of subspecies using DNA markers.

Sorry about the Texas HLs in Oklahoma. I know about the competition and "love" fer them Texans. Maybe we can keep the normal Genus/species names and change the common name, for you all in Oklahoma to the Oklahoma Horned Lizard ;) Lester G. Milroy III

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That sounds all and good Lester but................................. tom greb 06/07/02 (1)
- Re: That sounds all and good Lester but................................. Lester G. Milroy III 06/07/02 (0)

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: : : : I notice in the post below you say that Phrynosoma platyrhinos are protected in Cal. but i am confused hopefully you can set me straight on this but they are illegal to collect in california but yet places collect them Phrynosoma platyrhinos in NV and sell them over the internet? Is this a state or a Federal thing. and am i just completely wrong on this. : : : : Been doing so much reading on them My head is starting to spin. : : : : Another Question, What Species of Horned Lizard is or was from the Oklahoma and is it possible to get a permit to breed these lizards and would you know a source for them. : : : : Sorry for the stupid Questions. : : : : Chad : : : :Chad, the Desert HLs in California are protected from commercial collection. Permits are required for collection and are limited to the number that can be collected. It is a wildlife management guideline. It is called protecting natural resources and management. Nevada has their own guidelines for resource and wildlife management. Nevada will more than likely have species declines in the not to distant future, just like California has had in the past and continues to have today. At this point, Nevada is looking to make money for their general fund to support its growth. The animals are the the ones paying the price. In a 7 year period, the number of Desert Horned Lizards captured for the pet trade added up to 35,000. The number that survived? Unknown, but probably about 1 in 2500, after 2 to 5 five months in captivity. The number dead after field collection and before entering the pet trade, probably 1 in 15. Not good numbers. The HLs in Oklahoma are the Texas HL, Phrynosoma cornutum, and they are a protected species. You would have to check with Oklahoma Fish and Game to obtain permits. Lester G. Milroy III : : Ok thanks for the information, i just wasnt clear how the same species could be illegal in one state to collect and still legal in a bordering state. I would of thought that it would be as a Species for the entire country not per state. : : Dang talkin bout ruining my day tell me my Okie Horny Toads are the Texas Variety.... 8-( Dont you know us Okies dont like Texans very much.. : : Chad : :Hello again Chad. There have been folks fron Nevada cross the California - Nevada border, collect HLs from California and return to Nevada and sell the HLs in the pet trade. When they do this, it is called poaching and then comes under Federal Law with a violation under the Lacy Act. One of the projects in the works is ID of species using DNA markers. Population variation will aid in identifying populations of animals, almost to the exact locality of their collection. I am also working on the issue of subspecies using DNA markers. : Sorry about the Texas HLs in Oklahoma. I know about the competition and "love" fer them Texans. Maybe we can keep the normal Genus/species names and change the common name, for you all in Oklahoma to the Oklahoma Horned Lizard ;) Lester G. Milroy III

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