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Posted by pj on April 24, 2001 at 17:55:59:
In Reply to: Info for everyone.Turtles no longer considered reptiles. posted by Phil from Louisville on April 23, 2001 at 16:47:02:
The differences have been obvious to zoologists for years. I agree with the reclassification, but why should everything change just because the geneticists have weighed in. I agree w/ EricO that it will take time for the idea to gain acceptance and wider use. Did Collins mention that birds (and their dinosaur relatives) were closer to crocs then they are to lizards and snakes (which are essentially the same thing, Order: Squamata)? I'll bet the bird books won't be combined with the reptile field guide. There is no phylogenetic basis for including amphibians in the field guide either, as they are distantly related (mammals are thought to be between) to the traditional reptiles. Don't worry, by the time everyone learns the new taxonomy we will find a technique that changes it all again.
: Some interesting info to share with everyone.I attended Herpetology weekend at Natural bridge state park in Ky this past weekend,and had the opportunity to hear Dr Joseph Collins speak on current reptile classification.To those of you not familiar with Joe Collins,he is the co-author of the Peterson field guide,and keeps the updated list of the current statis of all N.A. species of reptiles on his web site which is an academic organization out of the university of Kansas that is the one that makes changes or revisions.The name has been changed to reflect the new changes and somehow I misplaced the web address.I'll find and post this later.All the taxonomy changes and references are available on this site according to him (I'll be real interested in this).
: Among the new changes that are currently in effect,is turtles are no longer considered reptiles.They are placed in a separate order which is called chelonia.According to him,they are no more closely related to reptiles than they are to mammals.This change is based on the newest molecular technology available.
: In addition,the subspecies concept is gone.There will be no more subspecies.However,a lot of subspecies will be elavated to specific statis.The biological species mode of systematics has now been replaced with the molecular species concept.
: These things have been peer reviewed,and ready to be unleashed.In fact,the new revised field guide will be entitled "Turtles,reptiles,amphibs,and croc of N.A".Pretty revolutionary stuff huh?.As Joe Collins was telling everyone this,he reminded us that he was simply the messenger on all these things.And that this new modal is the generally accepted result of a number of systemist research over the past few years.As for me ,I'm having a tough time with these changes,and I plan on taking a look at this new data.Thanks to those who are still with me ,I'd be interested in what you all think about this.
: Phil
