Re: Humidity/Pyramiding/Incubation of eggs

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Posted by A. C. Highfield on May 27, 2000 at 13:58:47:

In Reply to: Humidity/Pyramiding/Incubation of eggs posted by Jerry Fife on May 26, 2000 at 00:52:26:

Posted by Jerry Fife on May 26, 2000 at 00:52:26:
>

This is a bit of an oversimplification, Jerry. There is a big difference between various species, with soft-shelled eggs having rather different needs from hard-shelled eggs. Some reptile eggs (e.g., certain snake eggs) acquire moisture from the environment, while most tortoise eggs do not. The higher ambient humidity simply reduces losses *from* the egg.

No. This is a misunderstanding. No fluid whatsoever is absorbed either though skin or shell. None at all. In a higher humidity environment, less fluid is *lost* from a) evaporation via skin and b) respiration, in that order. Absolutely no fluid is absorbed from the environment, however.

> Is it possible that a normal manner? ??

I think survival would be more to the point. Without proper hydration it would die. There are three sources of water: 1) Rain 2) Dew/Mist 3) Metabolic (oxygen-hydrogen metabolism).

As stated, no fluid whatsoever is absorbed via the skin in reptiles. Basic biology.

>Some desert
from dehydrating from the extreme desert heat/sun. This humidity plays a role in keeping tortoises hydrated and healthy.>

Correct.

>If a hatchling tortoises is not properly hydrated what is the health impact?>

Renal failure and ultimately, death.

This is indeed a complex area, with many variables. However, the biology is actualy fairly well understood and is straightforward. If you are seeing differences in tortoises reared in higher humidity environments, it is not because of shell or skin absorbtion. Before I could really pass intelligent comment, I would need to see a complete and comprehensive analysis of your methodology, in detail. I'm sure we could then get to the bottom of it, however.

Andy C. Highfield

Tortoise Trust

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: Posted by Jerry Fife on May 26, 2000 at 00:52:26: : <Obviously we have no impact on the : <embryos diet, but if we do not provide adequate humidity the embryo will not <develop and will die. Humidity must play a role in development or high humidity <levels would not be recommended by Andy Highfield and other experts, for I<ncubating eggs.>> : This is a bit of an oversimplification, Jerry. There is a big difference between various species, with soft-shelled eggs having rather different needs from hard-shelled eggs. Some reptile eggs (e.g., certain snake eggs) acquire moisture from the environment, while most tortoise eggs do not. The higher ambient humidity simply reduces losses *from* the egg. : <Hatchling tortoises also require proper hydration; much of which comes from the <humidity in their dens, which is absorbed through their skin/shell.? : No. This is a misunderstanding. No fluid whatsoever is absorbed either though skin or shell. None at all. In a higher humidity environment, less fluid is *lost* from a) evaporation via skin and b) respiration, in that order. Absolutely no fluid is absorbed from the environment, however. : > Is it possible that a <young tortoise without proper hydration would not grow in a >normal manner? ?? : I think survival would be more to the point. Without proper hydration it would die. There are three sources of water: 1) Rain 2) Dew/Mist 3) Metabolic (oxygen-hydrogen metabolism). : <Hydration for tortoises may come from water that they drink, food that they eat or <absorbed through their skin.>> : As stated, no fluid whatsoever is absorbed via the skin in reptiles. Basic biology. : >Some desert : <species seldom see water or have fresh green vegetation to eat but their burrows provide humidity that prevents the tortoises : from dehydrating from the extreme desert heat/sun. This humidity plays a role in keeping tortoises hydrated and healthy.> : Correct. : >If a hatchling tortoises is not properly hydrated what is the health impact?> : Renal failure and ultimately, death. : This is indeed a complex area, with many variables. However, the biology is actualy fairly well understood and is straightforward. If you are seeing differences in tortoises reared in higher humidity environments, it is not because of shell or skin absorbtion. Before I could really pass intelligent comment, I would need to see a complete and comprehensive analysis of your methodology, in detail. I'm sure we could then get to the bottom of it, however. : Andy C. Highfield

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