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evolution of the rattle

[ Follow Ups ] [ Post Followup ] [ The Crotalidae Forum ]

Posted by east coast dave on April 23, 2002 at 23:03:18:

greetings. i can't remember the last time i posted to this forum, but nevertheless i have a question for you rattlesnake gurus.

saw the jeff corwin experience recently, and again (i seem to recall him saying this on more than one occasion) this guy goes into the >antiquated< explanation of the evolution of rattles as a way of protecting early rattlesnakes from large, boisterous ungulates that may trample them, i.e. buffalo.

i certainly do not believe everything i hear on tv, but this guy does seem to have at least some semblance of a background in science. i do not recall where i read this, but hasn't this theory been dismissed as not really holding any water? particularly, aren't modern rattlesnakes much more abundant and speciated in habitats that would never have been inhabitated by buffalo? is there really any hard evidence to suggest that rattlesnakes originated in the grassland prairies of north america?

anyone have any references in the current literature/thinking? or perhaps just some personal opinions.

in any case, i'm curious what you think.

ecd

Follow Ups:

An equally interesting question...... PatrickV 04/27/02 (1)
- hmmm ecd 04/27/02 (0)
Perhaps those first rattlers just "Got the beat". The Jerk 04/26/02 (0)
Re: evolution of the rattle PatrickR 04/25/02 (0)
Re: evolution of the rattle PatrickR 04/25/02 (1)
- Interesting, although... Kenny WRay 04/25/02 (0)
Re: evolution of the rattle Marty 04/24/02 (34)
- Re: evolution of the rattle Greg Knoell 04/25/02 (9)
  - Re: insects...... Rich G. 04/26/02 (4)
    - I can't tell you how many times... Kenny Wray 04/26/02 (3)
      - I've seen quite a few people gain altitude at the sound of a cicada........ GQ 04/26/02 (2)
        
        By the way, try throwing in a grasshopper or cricket to your mice.......... GQ 04/26/02 (1)
        
        Yes but don't throw a Grasshopper>> Jerry Feldner 05/16/02 (0)
  - completely agree here.......and... James Van Dyke 04/25/02 (3)
    - Unfortunately, almost none of this has... Kenny Wray 04/26/02 (1)
      - Klauberi tail coloration and caudal luring - Mike M. 05/02/02 (0)
    - Unfortunately, almost none of this has... Kenny Wray 04/26/02 (0)
- Does there have to be a specific reason? (more) WW 04/25/02 (4)
  - True, true James Can Dyke 04/25/02 (1)
    - Yeah, Lachesis have been hypothesized... Kenny Wray 04/26/02 (0)
  - Hey Wolfgang!... Kenny Wray 04/25/02 (1)
    - Hey Kenny, WW 04/26/02 (0)
- I would have to hypothesize... Kenny Wray 04/24/02 (18)
  - i agree east coast dave 04/24/02 (2)
    - Warning or death warrant......... Kerby... 04/25/02 (1)
      - ok, but not my point ecd 04/26/02 (0)
  - I don't totally dismiss the idea of a caudal lure....... Rich G. 04/24/02 (14)
    - Hey Rich... Kenny Wray 04/25/02 (10)
      - Good thoughts Kenny..... Rich G. 04/25/02 (9)
        
        Diversionary tactics... Jaffo 04/25/02 (8)
        
        Re: Diversionary tactics... Greg Knoell 04/25/02 (2)
        
        Re: Diversionary tactics... Jaffo 04/26/02 (1)
        
        I agree...more... Greg Knoell 04/26/02 (0)
        
        Re: Diversionary tactics... Rich G. 04/25/02 (4)
        
        As for the diversionary tactics... Kenny Wray 04/26/02 (0)
        
        Re: Diversionary tactics... Jaffo 04/26/02 (2)
        
        Re: Diversionary tactics... Rich G. 04/26/02 (1)
        
        That is very interesting Rich... Greg Knoell 04/26/02 (0)
    - But... James Van Dyke 04/24/02 (2)
      - I have observed........ Kerby... 04/25/02 (0)
      - We are talking about snakes I have had well over a decade... Rich G. 04/24/02 (0)

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Comments:
: greetings. i can't remember the last time i posted to this forum, but nevertheless i have a question for you rattlesnake gurus. : saw the jeff corwin experience recently, and again (i seem to recall him saying this on more than one occasion) this guy goes into the >antiquated< explanation of the evolution of rattles as a way of protecting early rattlesnakes from large, boisterous ungulates that may trample them, i.e. buffalo. : i certainly do not believe everything i hear on tv, but this guy does seem to have at least some semblance of a background in science. i do not recall where i read this, but hasn't this theory been dismissed as not really holding any water? particularly, aren't modern rattlesnakes much more abundant and speciated in habitats that would never have been inhabitated by buffalo? is there really any hard evidence to suggest that rattlesnakes originated in the grassland prairies of north america? : anyone have any references in the current literature/thinking? or perhaps just some personal opinions. : in any case, i'm curious what you think. : ecd

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